Welcome to the North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club Friday March 29, 2024
Home Forums Images WikiNASIOC Products Store Modifications Upgrade Garage
NASIOC
Go Back   NASIOC > NASIOC Technical > FA Series Factory 2.0L Turbo Powertrain

Welcome to NASIOC - The world's largest online community for Subaru enthusiasts!
Welcome to the NASIOC.com Subaru forum.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, free of charge, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, so please join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.







* As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases. 
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads. 
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-04-2020, 12:17 AM   #426
NighthawkSTI
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 495630
Join Date: Dec 2018
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by killadawg View Post
Sorry to bust your bubble there was no dyno plot.. nothing... this is hearsay and again.. 1k+ spend for what???? Just like the dude in the STI that wanted to so badly show me that his car was way!!!! faster with XXXXXX WHP etc.. etc.. I left him so far behind he was embarrassed that my supposed WHP was less than his and yet I was so much faster!! ##'s aren't everything (and where those numbers are generated is also subject to variances...) Please stop being so dumb NighthawkSTI... you must be a Tomei USA employee on commission cause damn you are adamant to continually proving nothing!! Cheers
so your validation that ELH are better than UELH's is your story of a "dude" that had an STI who bragged about a certain WHP but you beat him by a number of car lengths in a race LOL. Geee, in the 30 years I have been into car shows and modding cars etc...my guess would be that "dude" was pulling your leg about his horsepower numbers...its you know...kinda common for "dudes" to fib about power levels. Obviously he was making a lot less power than you if you actually raced. Not sure if that's something to brag about...I.E racing some clown that made stuff up about his car LOL.....but it must have been his UELH that let you beat him so badly, and wow, lucky for you this thread came along that gave you the opportunity to tell this fascinating account of ELH vs UELH
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
NighthawkSTI is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
* Registered users of the site do not see these ads.
Old 06-04-2020, 12:30 AM   #427
wuuusaa
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 92894
Join Date: Aug 2005
Chapter/Region: BAIC
Location: nomo splitting lanes LOL
Vehicle:
2015 Wrx - fury kit
silver duh

Default

^^^ LMAO, damn you must be really old? haha jk!
wuuusaa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2020, 01:30 PM   #428
killadawg
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 424203
Join Date: Jun 2015
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Boston, MA
Vehicle:
2016 WRX STage ??
Dirty

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NighthawkSTI View Post
so your validation that ELH are better than UELH's is your story of a "dude" that had an STI who bragged about a certain WHP but you beat him by a number of car lengths in a race LOL. Geee, in the 30 years I have been into car shows and modding cars etc...my guess would be that "dude" was pulling your leg about his horsepower numbers...its you know...kinda common for "dudes" to fib about power levels. Obviously he was making a lot less power than you if you actually raced. Not sure if that's something to brag about...I.E racing some clown that made stuff up about his car LOL.....but it must have been his UELH that let you beat him so badly, and wow, lucky for you this thread came along that gave you the opportunity to tell this fascinating account of ELH vs UELH
You finally got it!!! exactly my point... #'s mean nothing and that whole 2hp less or more is hearsay!! my account didn't even match the same cars, an older STI vs a newer WRX.. so it was Apples to Watermelons. Also the fact that many people will exaggerate their #'s like your whole story of "tons" of people on UELH making 600+ whp... you can probably make a short list that is not your perceived "tons" of people (where is the data!!).. (and again we need to be on an FA platform.. how many making 600+whp on UELH.. probably NONE!!) Hopefully y'all got a good giggle!!


yo wuuusaa
"^^^ LMAO, damn you must be really old? haha jk!"

Thank you for pointing that out, I'm LMAO as well!! (30 yrs ago I was modding Tonka trucks and Hotwheels tracks!)
killadawg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2020, 02:20 PM   #429
NighthawkSTI
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 495630
Join Date: Dec 2018
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by killadawg View Post
You finally got it!!! exactly my point... #'s mean nothing and that whole 2hp less or more is hearsay!! my account didn't even match the same cars, an older STI vs a newer WRX.. so it was Apples to Watermelons. Also the fact that many people will exaggerate their #'s like your whole story of "tons" of people on UELH making 600+ whp... you can probably make a short list that is not your perceived "tons" of people (where is the data!!).. (and again we need to be on an FA platform.. how many making 600+whp on UELH.. probably NONE!!) Hopefully y'all got a good giggle!!


yo wuuusaa
"^^^ LMAO, damn you must be really old? haha jk!"

Thank you for pointing that out, I'm LMAO as well!! (30 yrs ago I was modding Tonka trucks and Hotwheels tracks!)
the high horsepower UELH examples I was talking about were the countless dyno videos and 1/4 mile runs of documented builds that have been posted on the net that I have followed since 2004...actual documentation. That different than meeting someone random on the street and they're telling a horsepower number out of the air that is 99% of the time B.S. you know that.

True I havent really followed the FA20 relative to all out builds....but if UELH like the tomei have supported so many high horsepower all out builds (600+) since I have been following them for the STI series engines..which is a larger engine...then that header will flow enough and support those same horsepower levels on a SMALLER Subaru boxer engine(especially one with other power building advantages ever the EJ...direct injection..higher compression, etc....) , such that the header will never be a restriction..whether its a performance UELH or a performance ELH. at those horsepower levels. Its that simple.
NighthawkSTI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2020, 02:56 PM   #430
killadawg
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 424203
Join Date: Jun 2015
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Boston, MA
Vehicle:
2016 WRX STage ??
Dirty

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NighthawkSTI View Post
the high horsepower UELH examples I was talking about were the countless dyno videos and 1/4 mile runs of documented builds that have been posted on the net that I have followed since 2004...actual documentation. That different than meeting someone random on the street and they're telling a horsepower number out of the air that is 99% of the time B.S. you know that.

True I havent really followed the FA20 relative to all out builds....but if UELH like the tomei have supported so many high horsepower all out builds (600+) since I have been following them for the STI series engines..which is a larger engine...then that header will flow enough and support those same horsepower levels on a SMALLER Subaru boxer engine(especially one with other power building advantages ever the EJ...direct injection..higher compression, etc....) , such that the header will never be a restriction..whether its a performance UELH or a performance ELH. at those horsepower levels. Its that simple.
Yup this is a FA20DIT sub forum.. where EJ stuff is kinda irrelevant. Who cares if a non-DI and lower compression engine that doesn't suffer from LSPI. Again I don't know why you love comparing Apples to Watermelons... This platform was designed to work best on an ELH. The effects of LSPI with the use of an UELH are also unknown.. are people setting up little time bombs by this addition? getting higher performance is not always the whole story. Is it reliable? pushing a product with zero to no known research (where is this published? Tomei only states sound but no actual data)

Cheers
killadawg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2020, 08:24 PM   #431
NighthawkSTI
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 495630
Join Date: Dec 2018
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by killadawg View Post
Yup this is a FA20DIT sub forum.. where EJ stuff is kinda irrelevant. Who cares if a non-DI and lower compression engine that doesn't suffer from LSPI. Again I don't know why you love comparing Apples to Watermelons... This platform was designed to work best on an ELH. The effects of LSPI with the use of an UELH are also unknown.. are people setting up little time bombs by this addition? getting higher performance is not always the whole story. Is it reliable? pushing a product with zero to no known research (where is this published? Tomei only states sound but no actual data)

Cheers
Their product announcement says "boxer rumble again"...and it also has illustrations and measurements of the stock ELH showing where the restrictions are, and on the UELH that those flow restrictions are eliminated. So they are also advertising increased flow "capability"...the capability is what is important here, on a stock FA this header might be overkill, because it will probably be better matched to an FA with a lot more mods to reach its flow potential.
NighthawkSTI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2020, 08:53 PM   #432
killadawg
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 424203
Join Date: Jun 2015
Chapter/Region: NWIC
Location: Boston, MA
Vehicle:
2016 WRX STage ??
Dirty

Default

Again.. Advertising Fluff.. WIDER??? WTF... give actual numbers" Do you have any CFD data to prove flow characteristics?? Perring and KillerB units are WIDER and even less restrictive (KB even more so without all those damned connections and welds all over the place, and they showed us some nice CFD data to boot) They also offer ceramic coating and ewgs.. I just don't see how this product is competitive in the least. It even uses inferior materials compared to KB?? why why why must you try to convince anyone these are "better"??? Nope they aren't any better, they only make ****ty sounding noises.. like sticking a can on my bmx fork to make it rattle to sound like I had a motorcycle engine in it.. when I was like 6 yrs old thinking that was cool!!

Sorry I'm not a fan of the rumble as I come from Big Block Mopar and Chevy background that have a nice smooth deep sound (which I do miss) when it ever sounded like an old EJ on UELH I knew I must be misfiring and loosing power!
killadawg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2020, 09:14 PM   #433
Doughdreads
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 432734
Join Date: Oct 2015
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Savannah, GA
Vehicle:
2016 WRX Premium
Crystal White Pearl

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NighthawkSTI View Post
Their product announcement says "boxer rumble again"...and it also has illustrations and measurements of the stock ELH showing where the restrictions are, and on the UELH that those flow restrictions are eliminated. So they are also advertising increased flow "capability"...the capability is what is important here, on a stock FA this header might be overkill, because it will probably be better matched to an FA with a lot more mods to reach its flow potential.
WIDE! and VERY WIDE! ooOOoooOooo

...

The UELH was announced back at the end of March and Tomei hasn't produced any data on them - probably because these aren't meant for performance but for sound.

There is a 180 degree bend in them - I feel like that is a restriction in itself. They probably had to make the diameter of the runners wider so that it could maintain performance when compared to the stock header. Calling back to the example I posted, that build was FBO minus FF and made 300 on 91 with the stock header and 298 with the UELH. Going with any other aftermarket ELH (Perrin, Killer B, etc) you are going to see a performance increase and set up your build for the potential for even more power.

Take a look through the 50+ pages of builds in the dyno thread. Most owners aren't looking to make 400+ whp. Out of the pages I glanced through, most are around the high 200's - low to mid 300's - right around Stage 2 on 91 - 93 and the mid to upper 300's with ethanol. Most leaving the stock header. Anyone looking to hit 400+ is usually upgrading their turbo and header.

The bottom line is, no matter if these headers can support power, it is highly unlikely that someone who is looking to make power is going to use this header. Tomei didn't advertise these with any kind of dyno charts, any kind of performance gain estimates, only with "boxer rumble," 'WIDE," and "VERY WIDE!" They aren't advertising this as a performance part. I think that people in this thread are getting annoyed or "butt hurt" as you call it because you are trying to make it out to be more than it is. If people want their WRX to have the rumble, I don't care, let them do it. But no one can say for sure how it will affect the FA20's reliability and longevity or if it actually can support higher powered builds.
Doughdreads is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2020, 09:25 AM   #434
NighthawkSTI
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 495630
Join Date: Dec 2018
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doughdreads View Post
WIDE! and VERY WIDE! ooOOoooOooo

...

The UELH was announced back at the end of March and Tomei hasn't produced any data on them - probably because these aren't meant for performance but for sound.

There is a 180 degree bend in them - I feel like that is a restriction in itself. They probably had to make the diameter of the runners wider so that it could maintain performance when compared to the stock header. Calling back to the example I posted, that build was FBO minus FF and made 300 on 91 with the stock header and 298 with the UELH. Going with any other aftermarket ELH (Perrin, Killer B, etc) you are going to see a performance increase and set up your build for the potential for even more power.

Take a look through the 50+ pages of builds in the dyno thread. Most owners aren't looking to make 400+ whp. Out of the pages I glanced through, most are around the high 200's - low to mid 300's - right around Stage 2 on 91 - 93 and the mid to upper 300's with ethanol. Most leaving the stock header. Anyone looking to hit 400+ is usually upgrading their turbo and header.

The bottom line is, no matter if these headers can support power, it is highly unlikely that someone who is looking to make power is going to use this header. Tomei didn't advertise these with any kind of dyno charts, any kind of performance gain estimates, only with "boxer rumble," 'WIDE," and "VERY WIDE!" They aren't advertising this as a performance part. I think that people in this thread are getting annoyed or "butt hurt" as you call it because you are trying to make it out to be more than it is. If people want their WRX to have the rumble, I don't care, let them do it. But no one can say for sure how it will affect the FA20's reliability and longevity or if it actually can support higher powered builds.
The FA is an air pump...the EJ is an air pump. The EJ is 2.5 litres the FA is 2.0 litres. Aftermarket mandrel bent UELH have supported builds of 600++ horsepower from EJ 2.5's for 15 years of documented builds. Countless. The FA 2.0 is smaller moves less air than the 2.5 therefore the same header design that will support 600+ horsepower on the 2.5 will support that on a smaller 2.0...if the 2.0 can be built up to move as much air as the modded 2.5's. The UELH is not the restriction. That's the big picuture you noobs dont understand. Will a 600 horsepower FA or EJ make even more power and torque if a performance ELH is installed....if its a match for the combo at that level and a retune can extract it? sure why not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by killadawg View Post
Again.. Advertising Fluff.. WIDER??? WTF... give actual numbers" Do you have any CFD data to prove flow characteristics?? Perring and KillerB units are WIDER and even less restrictive (KB even more so without all those damned connections and welds all over the place, and they showed us some nice CFD data to boot) They also offer ceramic coating and ewgs.. I just don't see how this product is competitive in the least. It even uses inferior materials compared to KB?? why why why must you try to convince anyone these are "better"??? Nope they aren't any better, they only make ****ty sounding noises.. like sticking a can on my bmx fork to make it rattle to sound like I had a motorcycle engine in it.. when I was like 6 yrs old thinking that was cool!!

Sorry I'm not a fan of the rumble as I come from Big Block Mopar and Chevy background that have a nice smooth deep sound (which I do miss) when it ever sounded like an old EJ on UELH I knew I must be misfiring and loosing power!
Eh....cant really compare the sound of stacked exhaust pulses to a totally different manufacturers V8 that isnt firing on all cylinders. Nothing beats the sound of a 60's era muscle car V8 all built up with a free flowing exhaust, one that's not firing properly though will sound a lot more mechanically messed up than a nice running STI with a free flowing exhaust. Nobody is hearing a nice STI with an aggressive exhaust and saying...Hey that car is broken LOL. A backfiring sputtering V8 with a body shaking misfire? Not so much. Lets not try to strain so much to make the Boxer UELH sound worse than it is. I get nothing but compliments.....the most common being "it sounds good"! with emphasis on the word good! Exclamation. The rumble turns into a very aggressive ROAR at WOT....so its a wash

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doughdreads View Post
WIDE! and VERY WIDE! ooOOoooOooo

There is a 180 degree bend in them - I feel like that is a restriction in itself. .
Its not. Those are very nice mandrel bends..not crush bends. Again a lot of straining going on in this thread to make this header design look worse than it is....because of the sound they make...these people simply dont like the sound and will make invalid assumptions about the header.

Its straining and annoying to read nonfactual comments about this header design. They are relatively less efficient at scavenging exhaust compared to ELH. But that's it. a 2 horsepower difference is nullified and irrelevant and actually supports those that want to have a more aggressive exhaust sound with objectively zero performance loss...while keeping the potential for build ups of much more horsepower that the header will support.

Last edited by NighthawkSTI; 06-05-2020 at 10:14 AM.
NighthawkSTI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2020, 11:33 AM   #435
Doughdreads
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 432734
Join Date: Oct 2015
Chapter/Region: South East
Location: Savannah, GA
Vehicle:
2016 WRX Premium
Crystal White Pearl

Default

*Relatively less efficient at scavenging exhaust compared to the stock ELH. There hasn't been any comparisons done with an aftermarket ELH. Sure maybe this header can support a 400+ whp build, but who's to say that same build with an ELH wouldn't perform better?

This UELH is a replacement for the stock header, not an upgrade.
Doughdreads is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2020, 11:37 AM   #436
rtv900
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 428511
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: philadelphia
Vehicle:
2016 STI

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NighthawkSTI View Post
Its not. Those are very nice mandrel bends..not crush bends. Again a lot of straining going on in this thread to make this header design look worse than it is....because of the sound they make...these people simply dont like the sound and will make invalid assumptions about the header.
^I'll back this up

for gods sake its annoying as hell reading post after post of guys ranting about a 180 degree bend.
Who the hell cares, it's mandrel bent tubing, makes no f-ing difference if it's a full 180.

The only thing these affect is the damn twin scroll, that's it.
Delete all the posts of the guys who are deathly afraid of lugging and there won't be any complaints left, and the 2000 rpm peak torque is all you will lose.
rtv900 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2020, 12:43 PM   #437
Norm Peterson
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 498642
Join Date: Mar 2019
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: our wrx IS the family sedan
Vehicle:
'19 WRX Ltd 6M dgm
'08 Mustang GT (the toy)

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NighthawkSTI View Post
Eh...your getting a pretty high quality header for the money regardless of the sound or power supporting capabilities. The price is the price. And dont miss the bigger picture here again, those headers will support future bolt ons and not be a restriction...and will be better matched to an FA with full bolt ons relative to it being simply swapped for the stock header on a relatively otherwise stock FA.
I'm pretty sure that there were a few mods for that 2 HP difference comparison. Yeah, maybe if you did still more to the engine the unequal probably would come out slightly on top. But spending the exact same money on an equal length header is all but certain to make more power than with the unequal (i.e. even further beyond anything with the OE header). It still comes down to if you're talking about power, the build with the unequal is going to be outpowered by an otherwise comparable equal-length build.

No matter how you try to slice it, the unequal rumble is costing you power. How much the unequal can make is irrelevant here, knowing that you could have had still more power without spending any more money or working any harder. And the only reason here for leaving the equal length header's advantage on the table is because the rumble means more to you than the power.


Quote:
...the butt hurt is over the sound of the UELH pulses.....some people just hate that sound...
Ummm . . . seems to me that puts the hurt butts on the people here who like the rumble. Makes sense they might feel a bit insulted to hear (read?) that there are people who really don't find that particular sound pleasing to the ear, just some rattle-y noise from VWs and Subies of the past.


Norm

Last edited by Norm Peterson; 06-05-2020 at 12:50 PM.
Norm Peterson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2020, 01:16 PM   #438
3eyesraver
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 504042
Join Date: Jul 2019
Chapter/Region: SCIC
Location: SOCAL - Sothern Cali
Vehicle:
2018 WRX
ISM

Default

Tomei should make an UELH for a 2020 Porsche 911 Turbo S. Curious how it will sound.
3eyesraver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2020, 01:53 PM   #439
rtv900
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 428511
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: philadelphia
Vehicle:
2016 STI

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 3eyesraver View Post
Tomei should make an UELH for a 2020 Porsche 911 Turbo S. Curious how it will sound.
it already has one
rtv900 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-2020, 06:34 PM   #440
NighthawkSTI
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 495630
Join Date: Dec 2018
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Norm Peterson View Post
I'm pretty sure that there were a few mods for that 2 HP difference comparison

No matter how you try to slice it, the unequal rumble is costing you power.


Ummm . . . seems to me that puts the hurt butts on the people here who like the rumble. Makes sense they might feel a bit insulted to hear (read?) that there are people who really don't find that particular sound pleasing to the ear, just some rattle-y noise from VWs and Subies of the past.

Norm
The Subaru boxer sound is anything but "rattley" LOL..again straining to make it worse than it is. It sounds nothing like an Air cooled V.W...the Subaru boxer sound is much more aggressive, deep and muscular than those. Again...straining.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doughdreads View Post
*Relatively less efficient at scavenging exhaust compared to the stock ELH. There hasn't been any comparisons done with an aftermarket ELH. Sure maybe this header can support a 400+ whp build, but who's to say that same build with an ELH wouldn't perform better?

This UELH is a replacement for the stock header, not an upgrade.
Of course a performance ELH would outperform the stock ELH, stock and on a built engine. The tomei removes the neck downs in the casting and opens up the pipes for increased flow. Those neck downs are also removed with the UELH...so the UELH being relatively less efficient than the ELH at scavenging STILL wont be a limiting component to building a ton of power with other mods. Both are probably over kill on a stock engine and both would be better suited to much modded engines that can benefit from the increased flow in a performance ELH or UELH

The performance UELH will support way way more power over stock. Its all relative.

You 2.0 FA guys should be thanking your luck stars(see what I did there LOL), that manufacturers are expanding the parts available for these engines and giving people what they want...instead of Bit***g about it
NighthawkSTI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2020, 11:50 AM   #441
WMTwrx15
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 501927
Join Date: May 2019
Default

I can’t believe this has been going on this long....
WMTwrx15 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2020, 05:36 PM   #442
KillerBMotorsport
NASIOC Vendor
 
Member#: 198281
Join Date: Dec 2008
Chapter/Region: MAIC
Location: Virginia
Vehicle:
2005 WRX/STi
WRB of course

Default

Just for a taste or reality, here's a pic that's commonly found in a text book in regards to tube angle and flow dynamics. The short of it is the longer the bend angle the more turbulence and worse flow capacity, PERIOD.



Some of you should be ashamed of the misinformation you're spreading in a public forum where people are seeking knowledge.
KillerBMotorsport is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2020, 05:53 PM   #443
Comikazi
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 402552
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Canada
Vehicle:
2016 WRX

Default

Thanks Killer B for providing some actual facts and proof. I am one of those people just trying to learn and better understand header design.

Would you also be able to comment with any thoughts of the affects of using an unequal length header with a twin scroll turbo? Not talking specifically about the Tomei header here, just in general.

Is it as simple as everyone seems to think? You just get slower boost response and that's it?

Thanks
Comikazi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2020, 06:14 PM   #444
murrdogg24
Scooby Guru
 
Member#: 50586
Join Date: Dec 2003
Chapter/Region: BAIC
Location: Chiraq
Vehicle:
64 Impala

Default

murrdogg24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2020, 08:51 PM   #445
beau13990
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 259659
Join Date: Oct 2010
Default

I swore off this site years ago, but this is just too absurd for me to keep my promise.

I've driven plenty of EJ25s. They have a unique sound, which I liked. But the notion of introducing that trombone-like bend, and throwing out all of Subaru's development efforts, and paying for the privilege, all to make a new WRX sound like an EJ25 is absurd.

Anyone even considering that needs to go take a walk, skip some stones across a duck-filled pond, and reconsider his entire philosophy of life.

The latest version of the WRX is great. The "seat-of-the-pants" feel of all that usable torque is unreal. It honestly reminds me of an LS1. It hits you that hard in the back, that easily.

And I'd never take advice from anyone who'd let his exhaust tips get as dirty as those seen in that video. Come on, man. That's not a guy with a good head on his shoulders.
beau13990 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2020, 09:32 PM   #446
GlarryHoodDIT
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 460907
Join Date: Jan 2017
Chapter/Region: RMIC
Location: Colorado
Vehicle:
2020 Golf GTI

Default

How I picture Nighthawk in real life

http://www.cc.com/video-clips/f8uu2c...er-for-justice
GlarryHoodDIT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2020, 11:27 PM   #447
NighthawkSTI
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 495630
Join Date: Dec 2018
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by beau13990 View Post
I swore off this site years ago, but this is just too absurd for me to keep my promise.

I've driven plenty of EJ25s. They have a unique sound, which I liked. But the notion of introducing that trombone-like bend, and throwing out all of Subaru's development efforts, and paying for the privilege, all to make a new WRX sound like an EJ25 is absurd.

Anyone even considering that needs to go take a walk, skip some stones across a duck-filled pond, and reconsider his entire philosophy of life.

The latest version of the WRX is great. The "seat-of-the-pants" feel of all that usable torque is unreal. It honestly reminds me of an LS1. It hits you that hard in the back, that easily.

And I'd never take advice from anyone who'd let his exhaust tips get as dirty as those seen in that video. Come on, man. That's not a guy with a good head on his shoulders.
cool story bro That unbelievable torque monster 2.0 with the LS1 rivaling torque....forget about hellcats, coyote 5.0's and LS GM engines...its that ELH on the FA that has changed the performance market forever. Sell all your worldly possessions if you deny it or else your going to purgatory LMAO Moral of the story....clean your exhaust tips

Quote:
Originally Posted by WMTwrx15 View Post
I can’t believe this has been going on this long....
this is what a 2 HP difference does to the internet LMAO
NighthawkSTI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2020, 11:32 PM   #448
NighthawkSTI
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 495630
Join Date: Dec 2018
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by KillerBMotorsport View Post
Just for a taste or reality, here's a pic that's commonly found in a text book in regards to tube angle and flow dynamics. The short of it is the longer the bend angle the more turbulence and worse flow capacity, PERIOD.



Some of you should be ashamed of the misinformation you're spreading in a public forum where people are seeking knowledge.
well ya....a straight pipe flows the best. I am saying the larger picture here....a performance UELH on an FA 2.0 is not going to be the horsepower limiter when matched with other bolt on mods and meets the builders goals..whether it be 300, 400 or more horsepower....that UELH is actually overkill for the stock FA, its going to work better on a fully modded FA as would a better ELH. ELH scavenge better.

If you can translate the 180 degree bends on a FA(because that graphic while informative leaves out the design variables of everything before and after the 180 deg bend specific to the FA engine design) that for example is using a performance UELH and making 400 horsepower...how much power those bends are taking away...I'd love to see that illustrated....it would bring everything full circle here. I dont see that header limiting the FA to 340 horsepower as I argued against here when it was thrown out there or that it changes the way the twin scroll operates relatively speaking....the exhaust pulses are still entering a twin scroll housing...albiet with relatively less efficient scavenging over the ELH. Thank you for your input in advance.

Last edited by NighthawkSTI; 06-06-2020 at 11:57 PM.
NighthawkSTI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2020, 10:31 AM   #449
Norm Peterson
Scooby Specialist
 
Member#: 498642
Join Date: Mar 2019
Chapter/Region: Tri-State
Location: our wrx IS the family sedan
Vehicle:
'19 WRX Ltd 6M dgm
'08 Mustang GT (the toy)

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NighthawkSTI View Post
The Subaru boxer sound is anything but "rattley" LOL..again straining to make it worse than it is. It sounds nothing like an Air cooled V.W...the Subaru boxer sound is much more aggressive, deep and muscular than those. Again...straining.
Obviously you're not listening to the 'character' of the sound, only the deepness/muscularity (mainly a function of displacement).

"Aggressive" is such a worn-out term these days that it has really lost any meaning it might have had, never mind that it does not describe the character of a sound very well to begin with. It's the word that people these days reach for before even trying to describe anything that's a bit out of the ordinary.

Basically, if you can't hear the similarity between a flat-four VW and a flat-four unequal-length EJ or FA, you're either in denial or musically deaf.

I suppose I could have used the term 'syncopated' to describe the boxer rumble, but subjectively that's too complimentary of a term to use for a sound that's not particularly pleasing to the ear. And it might be a term that only a few people here would be familiar with, anyway. So rattle-y is it for now (it's certainly more descriptive than "aggressive").


Norm
Norm Peterson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-2020, 02:00 PM   #450
beau13990
Scooby Newbie
 
Member#: 259659
Join Date: Oct 2010
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NighthawkSTI View Post
cool story bro That unbelievable torque monster 2.0 with the LS1 rivaling torque....forget about hellcats, coyote 5.0's and LS GM engines...its that ELH on the FA that has changed the performance market forever. Sell all your worldly possessions if you deny it or else your going to purgatory LMAO Moral of the story....clean your exhaust tips



this is what a 2 HP difference does to the internet LMAO

Check out an LS1 dyno graph vs. an FA20F dyno graph. Under 4,000rpm, it's pretty damned close. Of course, you've made it clear that you only consider the peak horsepower number, so screw that, right? I mean, who ever ran an engine at under 4,000rpm?

And that dude's exhaust tips were disgusting. A bunch of crap spewed out when he started up, and even the guy standing by the back of the car looked disgusting. That car is running too rich or something. Whole video is just made of jackassery.
beau13990 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:57 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2024 Axivo Inc.
Copyright ©1999 - 2019, North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club, Inc.

As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases.

When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission
Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.