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Old 07-08-2020, 10:17 AM   #26
subaru_gc8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tsrapophis View Post
Yes, The whole turbo kit is custom built by a friend. The idea was to be able to keep a top mounted intercooler so the charge piping was a short. Heres a couple from during the build.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/pDcUA7ogPw9Yj3pk9
https://photos.app.goo.gl/oj3QVTVh8MXZvQkG6
I was just wondering if it could fit in the stock location without being rotated. what are youre thoughts of it fitting in the stock location?
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Old 07-08-2020, 12:27 PM   #27
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I was just wondering if it could fit in the stock location without being rotated. what are youre thoughts of it fitting in the stock location?
I think it can be done, The spoolinator kits from Killer B use some GTX35xx turbos, which have compressors that are quite a bit bigger than the G25, in the stock location. And the G25 turbine isn't much larger than a stock turbo. Last I heard Killer B was developing kits for the G25 as well.

IHI VF24 vs Garrett G25-660.

Last edited by tsrapophis; 07-08-2020 at 12:43 PM.
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Old 07-08-2020, 09:21 PM   #28
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Yeah they are. They're still waiting on an IWG version. Still.
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Old 07-08-2020, 10:11 PM   #29
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Yeah they are. They're still waiting on an IWG version. Still.
im sure wit all the crap going on its going to take alot longer to get things done
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Old 07-10-2020, 04:14 AM   #30
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im sure wit all the crap going on its going to take alot longer to get things done
Global supply chains are pretty messed up along with many companies having furloughs.
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Old 07-20-2020, 04:03 PM   #31
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I am running this g25 660 on my 1.8L audi TT, and want to swap it onto my foz honestly, especially after reading this. It would spool much better with the 2.5L over the 1.8. I may go for the G25-550 for the audi which would then push me to put it in the foz. I would also need to build the engine which would be a costly process.so really to get it in the foz I would need a FMIC, new inlet, downpipe, possibly intake manfiold...one day!

I would think you should be running the turbo at closer to 27PSI and even above that it gets more efficient. I think these turbos can run in the low to mid 30's safely.
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Old 07-20-2020, 09:32 PM   #32
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I'd love to see a 6258 vs G25-550 comparison on that 1.8.
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Old 07-21-2020, 12:04 AM   #33
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I'd love to see a 6258 vs G25-550 comparison on that 1.8.
The G25-550 really is a better compressor/turbine wheel size match than the G25-660.

This guy had a 660 and swapped to a 550 on his Audi A3.
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Old 07-21-2020, 02:01 AM   #34
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Global supply chains are pretty messed up along with many companies having furloughs.
yeah life stinks right now
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Old 11-03-2020, 06:27 PM   #35
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Post Autocross season update! Won my local class season championship (combined SM, SSM, Prep classes and Street Prep classes) Ironed out some new build issues and am preparing for next season.

Things found during season:
- Leaking cam seals, resolved
- Leaking turbo kit, resolved
- inadequate crank case venting


Things to do this winter for the Engine setup:
- improve Crank case venting.
- replace WRX intake manifold with port matched STI manifold, Power drops off at 7200rpm and engine builder has given me the green light for 8000rpm.
- Improve water flow in A2W intercooler system. Turns out my intercooler is undersized as well, so there's power left on the table. For now it works but gains 8 degrees of IAT per second and only recovers at about 3.5 degrees per second. The hoses are undersized to try and keep the underhood less busy, but I'm going to have to upsize. Also considering going to an electric water pump made for a small displacement engine's coolant.
- Convert to STI hubs/wheel bearings. I blew up 6 rear WRX wheel bearings during the season with 255mm wide 200tw BFG's. Going to do something custom.

I'm an engineer and love my car above all, so I'm going to fabricate myself some drop knuckles for my 5x114.3 conversion. The reasons for this are: (1. I can make them to accept bolt in 2008 STI wheel bearings all round instead of just the fronts like GD STI's (2. Going to do a Camaro Brembo brake conversion, The price savings of buying camaro Brembos versus STI brembos is ridiculous. (3. Roll center and bump steer correction. Wise fab makes drop knuckles already but this kind of design exercise is something I enjoy so I don't mind the time invested.

Since I have to buy Wheels and tires anyway, I'm going to widebody and go to 285's on 18x10.5 wheels. Stay tuned.
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Old 11-03-2020, 10:34 PM   #36
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First of all, congrats!

As another engineer, I like where this is going. I too had been looking into doing my own knuckles for my coupe, with the same thoughts of bolt-in rear bearings. But I'm planning on doing them billet and modular.

Sounds like a good call on the core. Curious how steady is the water inlet temps when you're comparing the IAT temps. Wondering if the heat exchanger might be struggling to dump heat to ambient as well.

What's wrong with your crankcase? What do you have done as of now?
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Old 11-04-2020, 12:03 AM   #37
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I didn't see it in your mod list but with those numbers and with autocrossing, an air oil separator may alleviate some of your crank case pressure issues and at the very least, increase the life of your build.

I'm sure you've considered it; just tossing it out as a +1. After putting mine on, there's no more issues with oil buildup in the intercooler or turbo inlet. Sweet build!
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Old 11-04-2020, 09:34 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by tsrapophis View Post
Post Autocross season update! Won my local class season championship (combined SM, SSM, Prep classes and Street Prep classes) Ironed out some new build issues and am preparing for next season.

Things found during season:
- Leaking cam seals, resolved
- Leaking turbo kit, resolved
- inadequate crank case venting


Things to do this winter for the Engine setup:
- improve Crank case venting.
- replace WRX intake manifold with port matched STI manifold, Power drops off at 7200rpm and engine builder has given me the green light for 8000rpm.
- Improve water flow in A2W intercooler system. Turns out my intercooler is undersized as well, so there's power left on the table. For now it works but gains 8 degrees of IAT per second and only recovers at about 3.5 degrees per second. The hoses are undersized to try and keep the underhood less busy, but I'm going to have to upsize. Also considering going to an electric water pump made for a small displacement engine's coolant.
- Convert to STI hubs/wheel bearings. I blew up 6 rear WRX wheel bearings during the season with 255mm wide 200tw BFG's. Going to do something custom.

I'm an engineer and love my car above all, so I'm going to fabricate myself some drop knuckles for my 5x114.3 conversion. The reasons for this are: (1. I can make them to accept bolt in 2008 STI wheel bearings all round instead of just the fronts like GD STI's (2. Going to do a Camaro Brembo brake conversion, The price savings of buying camaro Brembos versus STI brembos is ridiculous. (3. Roll center and bump steer correction. Wise fab makes drop knuckles already but this kind of design exercise is something I enjoy so I don't mind the time invested.

Since I have to buy Wheels and tires anyway, I'm going to widebody and go to 285's on 18x10.5 wheels. Stay tuned.
The IAG AOS is what to copy if you're building your own, if not, buy one used. They work.

I have a DBC JDM STi manifold on the shelf if you're interested

I built my own front and rear knuckles about 4-5 years ago now and while it saves money, the weight savings of a good aluminum knuckle is pretty substantial. I gifted my old setup to my 05 daily STi so it doesn't care about the extra weight, but it's still something like 7 lbs per side added.

Don't whimp out on wide body stuff. If you want to compete, shoot for at least 315's. A good percentage of SM nationally is on 335's now (including me).

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Originally Posted by Homemade WRX View Post
First of all, congrats!

As another engineer, I like where this is going. I too had been looking into doing my own knuckles for my coupe, with the same thoughts of bolt-in rear bearings. But I'm planning on doing them billet and modular.

Sounds like a good call on the core. Curious how steady is the water inlet temps when you're comparing the IAT temps. Wondering if the heat exchanger might be struggling to dump heat to ambient as well.

What's wrong with your crankcase? What do you have done as of now?
The rear knuckles see very little abuse in comparison to the front, so while the bolt in is super nice, all the design work and such to make it happen seems excessive. I think it's like...30 minutes for me to pull the rear knuckle and another 30 pressing everything in/out. I only do it once every 4 years of autox and the bearings seem to come out fine. And you know I don't have mechanical sympathy
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Old 11-04-2020, 11:31 AM   #39
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Nice to hear, it's give me some motivation to get my build done. Any idea why your cam seals were leaking?
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Old 11-04-2020, 12:34 PM   #40
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So, as far as the crank case pressure goes. I was running a single AOS of my own design that I had setup to mount where my AC comp used to be and drain back into the pan with a ball valve, and it was just undersized. I added an extra AOS mid season to handle just the crank case venting and then the head venting was going to the original AOS. I think this will be fine, except that I bent up some hardlines for the head vents and they are undersized as well. I completely underestimated how much air needs to move there as well as the oil spewing effects of any backpressure whatsoever. I'll go overkill with it and never worry again, easy peasy.

A2W, I do not have water temps yet as I ran out of sensor inputs on my Megasquirt so just IAT. But I have the largest heat exchanger offered on frozen boost (rated 1200hp theoretically) which is always cool to the touch. I never have to spray it between runs or even idle the car for more than 30 seconds after a run. Everything recovers well and I knowingly undersized the hoses, so I'm going to fix the known issue first and see how it reacts. even so, on 100 degree days my IAT's are under 165 on an autocross run and I have a very conservative progressive timing retard (0.5 degree at 125f, 1 degree at 145f, 2 degree at 160f and 4 degree at 170).

The cam seals leaked because I reused the intake cam pulleys from a fubar'd engine. Those cam pulleys had some minuscule roughness on the sealing surface that tore apart the cam seals. replaced them with OEM and it stopped immediately.

I am setting everything up to be able to run 315's eventually, the wheels and wide body I'm using will be able to accept them but there's a cost consideration and I'm a bit nervous about whats going to break first. so I'm looking at 285 falken 660's. I'm running XSA, I fit the minimum weight pretty well and I like the savings of street tires vs Hoosiers.

Thanks for the input everyone! I appreciate it.
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Old 11-04-2020, 12:41 PM   #41
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The rear knuckles see very little abuse in comparison to the front, so while the bolt in is super nice, all the design work and such to make it happen seems excessive. I think it's like...30 minutes for me to pull the rear knuckle and another 30 pressing everything in/out. I only do it once every 4 years of autox and the bearings seem to come out fine. And you know I don't have mechanical sympathy
I believe you that the press in bearings would last with what I'm doing, but after 6 in a season I'm about done with press in bearings. lol. Figured while I'm at it I might as well. I've also been focusing on tuning my suspension to load the rear more equally to the front. I was smoking my front tires and the rears were cool so I started working on it and was making good progress until I'd pop a bearing after half a day.
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Old 11-04-2020, 03:15 PM   #42
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I am setting everything up to be able to run 315's eventually, the wheels and wide body I'm using will be able to accept them but there's a cost consideration and I'm a bit nervous about whats going to break first. so I'm looking at 285 falken 660's. I'm running XSA, I fit the minimum weight pretty well and I like the savings of street tires vs Hoosiers.

Thanks for the input everyone! I appreciate it.
The fast big 200TW tires are about as expensive as hoosiers, if not more so in some cases (A052). I'm actually not running XSA because I don't want to spend the money on a set of 200TW that's slower and less fun to drive on

But I'll tell you the wear and tear is less component related and more "check your subframes more often for tears" related.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tsrapophis View Post
I believe you that the press in bearings would last with what I'm doing, but after 6 in a season I'm about done with press in bearings. lol. Figured while I'm at it I might as well. I've also been focusing on tuning my suspension to load the rear more equally to the front. I was smoking my front tires and the rears were cool so I started working on it and was making good progress until I'd pop a bearing after half a day.
It takes a lot to make these cars us front and rear kind of equally. I've come close, but my car also has a weight balance of 54.x% front and 45.x% rear. Now though I rarely have to spray tires (having 335's helps too) and while the bias is still to the front for weight it's very easy to tune the handling with minor adjustments.

All that to say, don't spend time on things that don't make you faster. Don't do half steps knowing you'll need to redo them later to take a full step.
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Old 11-04-2020, 09:00 PM   #43
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Update, Went to the drag strip and ran some back to back 12.3's@115mph. pump gas + octane booster, street tires, 21psi of boost pressure. Best 60' was 1.7, datalogs show that my A2W intercooler is undersized for the horsepower, IAT's got up to 174. I have my megasquirt ECU programmed to progressively pull timing starting at 145 so I went through the traps with 9 degrees of ignition timing rather than the 13.5 I usually run.

To address this I am going to do 3 things.
1.) design and have built a custom intercooler using a Garrett A2W 750hp core, currently my 450hp china special is just not cutting it. I would go with their 1000hp core to be safe but I still want it top mounted and there are space constraints. I am fairly certain this is the issue, I have upgraded the intercooler pump and not seen any improvements in the rate of heat soak. I do not have a thermocouple in the intercooler coolant loop but to the touch it does not reflect the temps I'm seeing on my IAT's.
2.) Replace intake manifold with the 2005 NA impreza manifold. I've done some rough volume calcs and the 2002 WRX manifold I'm using is very small for the EJ257 I'm running. It's been great for response but the NA manifold has a better design IMO. I will also be converting to drive by wire (DBW) and moving the throttle body to the inlet of my W2A intercooler. This will allow me to directly bolt the intercooler to the intake manifold and gives me extra space to fit the larger intercooler. My concern with this is that I will increase lag. I did some rough calcs for intake manifold volume before and after these changes and I will go from a Intake manifold/engine displacement ratio of 0.91 currently to 1.45 with the new setup. Although this is a big jump, my current setup is very skewed towards response over power and so the new ratio should put me in a very normal range.
3.) Add and datalog a Turbo speed sensor. From initial turbo sizing calcs I am fairly sure that I am pushing this turbo into an inefficient zone for the low pressure ratio I'm running on pump gas. I may limit my RPM shorter if I am drastically overworking the turbo above say 7200rpm.
9 degrees of timing at what rpm? If that’s peak timing up top then that’s very very low, do you monitor egts at all?
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Old 11-05-2020, 09:28 AM   #44
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9 degrees of timing at what rpm? If that’s peak timing up top then that’s very very low, do you monitor egts at all?
I don't remember what rpm I crossed the line, but I run 13.5 degrees timing at 7200. The 9 degrees was a product of my IAT based timing retard. I used to run more timing, but I've got air flow restrictions that mean I don't make any power past 7200, so in the future when I upgrade to fix that I'll pay more attention to that section of the tune. I'm not monitoring egts, but only because I ran out of analog inputs. Working on expanding I/O. The car is driven a lot and never gently so I don't mind keeping the tune a little gentle up top and full in the mid range.
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Old 11-05-2020, 08:27 PM   #45
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I don't remember what rpm I crossed the line, but I run 13.5 degrees timing at 7200. The 9 degrees was a product of my IAT based timing retard. I used to run more timing, but I've got air flow restrictions that mean I don't make any power past 7200, so in the future when I upgrade to fix that I'll pay more attention to that section of the tune. I'm not monitoring egts, but only because I ran out of analog inputs. Working on expanding I/O. The car is driven a lot and never gently so I don't mind keeping the tune a little gentle up top and full in the mid range.
I was just mostly curious, I have been tuning Subaru’s as well as other platforms on and off for probably close to a decade and usually up top depending on the setup I have been running anywhere between 17-21 degrees around 7krpm. Running a good amount less usually resulted in a a good power drop as well as higher egts and that’s running straight 92 octane pump and 11 flat afr. None of those setups were a true track setup tho, still I would imagine that you would run more timing than that. But if your intake temps reach 170* then that definitely needs to get fixed. But at least maybe run a standalone egt gauge, even if you can’t log it at least you know what it’s at. I have been eyeballing the g25-660 as well, seems like it has extremely good performance for what it is.
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Old 11-06-2020, 05:03 PM   #46
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I was just mostly curious, I have been tuning Subaru’s as well as other platforms on and off for probably close to a decade and usually up top depending on the setup I have been running anywhere between 17-21 degrees around 7krpm. Running a good amount less usually resulted in a a good power drop as well as higher egts and that’s running straight 92 octane pump and 11 flat afr. None of those setups were a true track setup tho, still I would imagine that you would run more timing than that. But if your intake temps reach 170* then that definitely needs to get fixed. But at least maybe run a standalone egt gauge, even if you can’t log it at least you know what it’s at. I have been eyeballing the g25-660 as well, seems like it has extremely good performance for what it is.
I was at 17.5 degrees when I first did the tune and was looking for max power, I brought it down to 13.5 because I tuned in ideal weather conditions and I intend to spend a lot of time around limiter while in competition. I'll probably get back on the dyno next year and retune but for now I don't mind losing 15-20hp for safety.
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Old 11-06-2020, 05:57 PM   #47
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I was at 17.5 degrees when I first did the tune and was looking for max power, I brought it down to 13.5 because I tuned in ideal weather conditions and I intend to spend a lot of time around limiter while in competition. I'll probably get back on the dyno next year and retune but for now I don't mind losing 15-20hp for safety.
I understand but I’m just saying double check egts, cause less timing may not necessarily make it safer if you get what I’m saying.
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Old 11-30-2020, 09:37 PM   #48
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The rear knuckles see very little abuse in comparison to the front, so while the bolt in is super nice, all the design work and such to make it happen seems excessive.
For me it's more of the "if I'm in there, I may as well" type of feature to add. Makes a potential track side repair much faster, and much more doable for those without a press. <-----someone still me, without a press
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Old 12-01-2020, 05:32 PM   #49
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For me it's more of the "if I'm in there, I may as well" type of feature to add. Makes a potential track side repair much faster, and much more doable for those without a press. <-----someone still me, without a press
Exactly my thinking. I've already decided I want to design my own for the experience and to adapt camaro brembos, so while I'm there I might as well make it more serviceable and arguably stronger. Same amount of work either way.
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Old 12-01-2020, 05:46 PM   #50
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Update, I've sourced some used wheels and tires and I will be going to 315 as advised. Thank you all for the input. Found some WedsSport TC105N's in 18x10.5 +12mm wrapped in some very cheap BFG rivals.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/AxDfvsCJYDiGnb8z7
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