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12-21-2015, 10:40 PM | #51 | |
Scooby Newbie
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Quote:
Youll get this same answer pretty much everywhere you go. Egr delete on its own is 50$ and delete a check engine light. Imo, egr is the biggest contributor to the build up. 300-400$ for an AOS and you shoild be done. Thats 500$. If that lets you go 2 years without walnut blasting then you saved money. AND if thats not enough, havingn clean intake valves will probably save you a few dollars im gas a month, too
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01-02-2016, 12:15 PM | #52 | |
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01-03-2016, 01:07 PM | #53 |
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I see how deleting the EGR would certainly help with carbon build up; no question there.
I'm having a hard time understanding though how and AOS/catch can won't have as much, if not more, of a positive effect on intake valve build-up after installation. Sure, the valves shown in the "before" pics have carbon on them but what I see more of in those pics is oily, gunky build-up that resembles something that could be prevented from a decent AOS or catch can. I'm leaning towards the idea that a valve cleaning and an AOS/catch can would have a greater overall preventative effect than a valve cleaning and EGR delete. |
04-11-2016, 11:25 PM | #54 |
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Any update on this?
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04-12-2016, 09:17 AM | #55 |
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04-14-2016, 11:51 PM | #56 |
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Install a meth injection kit and it shouldn't be a problem.
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10-19-2016, 09:08 PM | #57 |
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Location: Pennsylvania
Vehicle:2016 WRX |
Great post, with real science. I like it. Thanks for this!
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11-11-2016, 12:38 AM | #58 |
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Great read, thanks again for excellent info!
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11-15-2016, 09:19 AM | #59 | |
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Quote:
A tune would be necessary because EGR will impact manifold pressure. Gas mileage would go down because you are taking out unburned fuel/hydrocarbons from the mix. The hot EGR gases also help atomize the A/F mixture. Time to torque would actually improve with a delete kit since you get less inert gases mixed in with the A/F. And yes, any OEM that runs EGR has to deal with varying degrees of fouling. Toyota had issues with their previous gen Priuses. |
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11-17-2016, 11:00 AM | #60 | |
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12-09-2016, 10:15 AM | #61 |
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12-09-2016, 10:16 AM | #62 |
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Thank you for the post Unabomber
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12-09-2016, 10:31 AM | #63 |
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Also would like to contribute here...
2016 WRX, just hit 25K miles yesterday and I have noticed a SIGNIFICANT drop in gas mileage over the pas 15K miles. I have not inspected my intake tract but I'd imagine it's similar (if not worse) to the pics posted. There's also a great install viedo on EGR deletes showing the accumulated gunk on a LOW mileage (7K miles) 2016 WRX from a channel I follow. Skip to 6:30 to see buildup. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sgx0vNtnoRw |
12-09-2016, 11:52 AM | #64 |
Big Ron
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Added video to first post....never thought to post what the EGR thingy looked like as well. While it is just a bunch of internet nerds with internet theories....the EGR looks to be the main cause of all the gook.
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12-09-2016, 12:32 PM | #65 |
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One more look at the EGR system pulled out of the engine.... short and informative.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yoOhNPQ3Uzc |
02-25-2017, 05:34 PM | #66 | |
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Quote:
https://forums.nasioc.com/forums/sho....php?t=2828928 Jon |
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04-02-2017, 02:55 AM | #67 | |
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http://www.european-autowerks.com/Mo...la-murrieta-ca |
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04-08-2017, 03:14 PM | #68 |
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same here, had the same car, loved it, beat on it, blew it up, fixed and beat it up some more
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04-17-2017, 06:46 PM | #69 |
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04-18-2017, 08:54 PM | #70 |
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I think I've read all the FA threads on TGV and EGR deletes. Why is it a bad idea to remove your TGV but leaving your EGR?
I'm kind of leaning towards TGV delete + unplugging EGR with a tune to remove the codes. |
04-18-2017, 09:40 PM | #71 | |
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04-20-2017, 03:35 PM | #72 |
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Great read man! much appreciated. I installed an EGR delete and a vent to atmosphere air oil separator at about 10K but im still going to pull the manifold to take a look.
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07-25-2017, 02:22 PM | #73 | |
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Quote:
As for the TGV delete it will kill your gas mileage without a proper tuning and the EGR delete. It will net a bit of top end power more so on the WRX than my FXT. Without the EGR delete it doesn't keep your valves cleaner. EGR Delete kit is cheaper than the TGV kit. There is a link a couple of posts up showing people figuring out how to tune for the combination properly and why you have to do both at once in order to get a smooth tune. When we were attempting to get my Stage 2 dialed in I came across some interesting readings on my TGV's. After discussing it with my tuner I did the TGV deletes re-ran the car on the dyno to dial in the tune and I was actually making less power. We thought it may have been bad tank of fuel...After taking a hit on my gas mileage in my daily driving and doing a lot of research on the FA20DIT TGV's I decided to put them back in the car. The older Subies that had TGV's were basically closed on startup and open fully when the car was up to operating temp. "The FA20DIT has separate timing maps for TGV open and closed, and we can see major differences in low load areas. The dynamic advance maps (which are added on top of the base values, depending on knock activity) for TGV open and closed are pretty close at lower load areas where the TGV is actually used." So in short they help with knock prevention at lower loads. i.e. cruising at 70mph on CC. More great info on how the FA20DIT systems work compared to the EJ motors and where the quoted text came from are found here: https://forums.nasioc.com/forums/sho....php?t=2687550 I personally had my mechanic take a good look at my valves so see if we needed to walnut blast them. Fortunately no. I added a Crawford AOS but may be switching to either the IAG or Radium setup if I can afford it after fixing the rest of my current issues.... As for SeaFoam they make a specific top end cleaning product it has a long tube with a corner hook built into it. It is made to go into the hose that comes out of your intercooler feeding the throttle plate. I did this clean once which is probably why my valves didn't look really gummed up. Warning if you are running an upgraded TMIC, like I am, it can be a pita to get the tube past the bigger hose barb compared to stock. Some people on youtube have made adapters to inject it through the MAP sensor hole. This however defeats cleaning the throttle plate and also makes a more uneven disbursement of the cleaner throughout the rest of the intake system. I also bought the Subaru top end/fuel system cleaning kit. It's comprised of a gas additive, a throttle body spray cleaner and a vacuum line additive to clean the rest of the top end including the valves. The kit was like $15 but finding the darn "tool" to connect to the vacuum system and the price seem kind of extreme for a check ball valve, a coat hanger, a vacuum tube and fitting. I figured I could piece together my own it if necessary. Last edited by freakshow999; 07-25-2017 at 03:58 PM. |
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08-18-2017, 11:44 AM | #74 | |
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Hahahahahahhahahahaha omg. Talk about your typical engineered bulls*** response. "Our systems are perfect with no flaws whatsoever, even if it's the exact same as other systems with the same flaws" lollllll makes me wonder if any of the engineers over at Subaru have ever even changed their own oil. Everyone start flooding SOA with pics of your intake tracts, annnnnd go!! |
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09-15-2017, 09:04 AM | #75 | |
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The key word they used here, the lawyer-approved million dollar word is: "As a result abnormal residue and carbon deposits are not created" So deposits and residue happen, but there's normal, and then there's abnormal. You can show them the pics and they'll call it normal. My feeling so far is that I haven't seen any alarming buildup pics yet. Someone mentioned here before - the most important thing to understand is whether deposits grow indefinitely or plateau at a reasonable point. But reasonable would be no discernible power or efficiency impact. I wouldn't be thinking about this at all if it weren't for the before/after walnut blast dyno. That tells us that even minimal deposits can have a surprising impact. I'm in camp "wait and see." My fuel econ is same as it always was, butt dyno says all systems green. I'm at 35k mi, been using low SAPS oil which should be helping to keep the EGR a little cleaner. Is it possible to get a borescope to the valves without significant disassembly? *edit* I borrowed a borescope and went into the manifold at that central sensor port. Couldn't see anything! This was the best image I got, and I'm not even sure it's actually a valve I'm going to keep on trusting that my M1 5W30 ESP is keeping things clean Last edited by fredzy; 09-19-2017 at 10:54 AM. |
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