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Old 05-06-2021, 11:09 PM   #76
left footed whooten
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Last 2 posts, from brandon and VC definitely thicken the plot. Im not opposed to a new and different concept, but i know next to nothing about I3's... except for Rita, Judy, And Marcia.
Thanks for bringing some factual info stuffs.
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Old 05-07-2021, 02:33 AM   #77
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which means it is not as free revving
I’ve kind of noticed this in the GR4 in-cabin videos. Revs are slower and I like a quick revving engine. And a 8k redline. Meh, so many cars are coming that we have to wait year(s) on. Don’t believe the hype it’s a sequel.
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Old 05-07-2021, 09:41 AM   #78
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And the Corolla will be even heavier.

BMW also uses a 1.5 3pot with ~230 hp.
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Old 05-07-2021, 12:53 PM   #79
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I'm okay with a 3 banger, but do not want another 4-5 door car at the moment..
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Old 05-07-2021, 03:51 PM   #80
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No. The opposite is true. As Neg mentioned above the fewer the cylinders the further the crankshaft has to turn before the next power stroke. For a 3cyl to make as much torque as a 4cyl (with everything else being equal) it needs a heavier flywheel to store energy between power strokes. A heavier flywheel means more rotational inertia, which means it is not as free revving. One of the advantages of using more cylinders is being able to run lighter and lighter flywheels.

I am not a fan of the 3cyl thing partially because of the above, and partially because it is a horribly imbalanced engine layout. The imbalance requires a (heavier, on a per cylinder basis) counterbalance shaft which again increases rotational inertia. An inline 4cyl is not great in the balance arena, but it's better than the 3. The advantage of the 3cyl is packaging. Not my cup of tea though.

Brandon


I agree on the heavier flywheel; that's true and I forgot to mention it earlier.
But, from what I'm reading, I3 are easier to balance than I4.
The I3 doesn't have any imbalances due to the up/down motion of the pistons.
The only imbalance comes from the rotation of the crankshaft.
The I4 has high imbalance due to the motion of the pistons; it's in the order of the square of the engine speed.
So, it's low at low speeds and very high at higher speeds.
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Old 05-07-2021, 05:25 PM   #81
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I've finished pouting over us not getting the Yaris. If Toyota manages to bring us the WRX hatch that Subaru refuses to build, I'll definitely give it a hard look. If the 3 cylinder can push the AWD system in a 3000 lb car in a way that makes me smile, It'll be hard to pass up. Toyota seems to be on a roll lately.
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Old 05-07-2021, 07:43 PM   #82
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Originally Posted by neg_matnik View Post
I agree on the heavier flywheel; that's true and I forgot to mention it earlier.
But, from what I'm reading, I3 are easier to balance than I4.
The I3 doesn't have any imbalances due to the up/down motion of the pistons.
The only imbalance comes from the rotation of the crankshaft.
The I4 has high imbalance due to the motion of the pistons; it's in the order of the square of the engine speed.
So, it's low at low speeds and very high at higher speeds.
The up and down of the pistons makes the i3 want to shake up and down, requiring a single balance shaft, but Ford has found a way to go without it. I think the results speak for themselves - i3s can be smooth and sound great, so I wouldn't rule them out, especially when a major downside of turbo inline fours is they sound like crap.
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Old 05-07-2021, 07:46 PM   #83
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I'm really not a fan of turbo inline fours where sound is concerned. Gimme something different.
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Old 05-07-2021, 07:55 PM   #84
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I'm really not a fan of turbo inline fours where sound is concerned. Gimme something different.
I don't think there's a single one out there that sounds really good. Most of them are bad and then there's a few outliers that sound just okay like the Veloster N for example.
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Old 05-07-2021, 09:47 PM   #85
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I don't think there's a single one out there that sounds really good. Most of them are bad and then there's a few outliers that sound just okay like the Veloster N for example.
Best is probably something like an Alfa 4C. If the Italians can't make a turbo 4 sound good, nobody can.

It sounds pretty good but compared to an Italian six or eight, no comparison.

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Old 05-07-2021, 10:14 PM   #86
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I'm really not a fan of turbo inline fours where sound is concerned. Gimme something different.
Me either. The only inline 4 I have ever loved is in my garage. It’s in a motorcycle and it has a crossplane crankshaft that mimics the firing order of a 90 degree V4. It is one of the best feeling and sounding motors I’ve ever piloted. I also have a V4 motorcycle and the crossplane i4 sound and feels better. I wish one of the stupid mfr’s would do a turbo V4. It would be an instant classic.
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Old 05-07-2021, 10:48 PM   #87
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Me either. The only inline 4 I have ever loved is in my garage. It’s in a motorcycle and it has a crossplane crankshaft that mimics the firing order of a 90 degree V4. It is one of the best feeling and sounding motors I’ve ever piloted. I also have a V4 motorcycle and the crossplane i4 sound and feels better. I wish one of the stupid mfr’s would do a turbo V4. It would be an instant classic.
Which motorcycle? I'm gonna start familiarizing myself more with notable bikes. Learn some new stuff.
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Old 05-08-2021, 01:17 PM   #88
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Which motorcycle? I'm gonna start familiarizing myself more with notable bikes. Learn some new stuff.
2009-2021 Yamaha R1’s use crossplane crankshaft inline 4’s. And they have used this same engine in their M1 since 2004.
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Old 05-08-2021, 01:54 PM   #89
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Thanks! I got some research to do.
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Old 05-08-2021, 08:05 PM   #90
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Is it just me, but before this news, people were like "Oh the Corolla is going to be crap if it doesn't have the AWD, engine, transmission, and Diffs of the GR Yaris". Now it looks like it does and the comments are like "I don't want a car with a 3-cylinder, 4/5 doors, hatchback, headlights, etc."

Seriously, you knew what this car was potentially going to be (a GR Yaris drivetrain in a Corolla Hatch), but feel the need to complain that it actually may come to fruition for once? This why we don't get the good stuff, and why the stuff we get is half assed crap (A90 Supra).
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Old 05-08-2021, 10:20 PM   #91
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The engine has been in question since Day 1 of the tease from Toyota on their website. It was impressive already with how well it works with the Yaris, but putting it in a larger, heavier Corolla and keeping it fun would be even more impressive.

We jaded.
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Old 05-08-2021, 11:58 PM   #92
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Is it just me, but before this news, people were like "Oh the Corolla is going to be crap if it doesn't have the AWD, engine, transmission, and Diffs of the GR Yaris". Now it looks like it does and the comments are like "I don't want a car with a 3-cylinder, 4/5 doors, hatchback, headlights, etc."

Seriously, you knew what this car was potentially going to be (a GR Yaris drivetrain in a Corolla Hatch), but feel the need to complain that it actually may come to fruition for once? This why we don't get the good stuff, and why the stuff we get is half assed crap (A90 Supra).
Nope. We were saying we don't want bait switch that the Corolla is. A small batch for WRC unique Yaris it is not.

Others were saying they wanted the more doors and kid seat versatility and some such words.
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Old 05-09-2021, 01:41 AM   #93
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Is it just me, but before this news, people were like "Oh the Corolla is going to be crap if it doesn't have the AWD, engine, transmission, and Diffs of the GR Yaris". Now it looks like it does and the comments are like "I don't want a car with a 3-cylinder, 4/5 doors, hatchback, headlights, etc."

Seriously, you knew what this car was potentially going to be (a GR Yaris drivetrain in a Corolla Hatch), but feel the need to complain that it actually may come to fruition for once? This why we don't get the good stuff, and why the stuff we get is half assed crap (A90 Supra).
I've been consistent in my statement that it would take an extra cylinder to make the car special enough to interest me in the Corolla. (Long before it was even confirmed they were using the 3 cyl)

And this car is still half assed crap next to the Yaris

The Yaris is the good stuff.

Toyota put the question out on social media if NA wanted the Yaris, and blueballed us, only to tease what in all likelihood is going to be an inferior car.

Who do we have to blame for not getting the Yaris?
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Old 05-09-2021, 09:58 AM   #94
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I've been consistent in my statement that it would take an extra cylinder to make the car special enough to interest me in the Corolla. (Long before it was even confirmed they were using the 3 cyl)

And this car is still half assed crap next to the Yaris

The Yaris is the good stuff.

Toyota put the question out on social media if NA wanted the Yaris, and blueballed us, only to tease what in all likelihood is going to be an inferior car.

Who do we have to blame for not getting the Yaris?
If they put the drivetrain and diffs in a Corolla hatch then it makes perfect sense- it would probably outsell the tiny GR4 in the US market, and still satisfy many GR4 enthusiasts cause it’s more hardcore than the competition. Yeah it’s heavier but it’s way more practical and looks better to me.

If we get no diffs and 270 hp as I suspect then it’s really just a WRX or Golf R light competitor and won’t interest GR4 fans.
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Old 05-09-2021, 02:54 PM   #95
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Is it just me, but before this news, people were like "Oh the Corolla is going to be crap if it doesn't have the AWD, engine, transmission, and Diffs of the GR Yaris". Now it looks like it does and the comments are like "I don't want a car with a 3-cylinder, 4/5 doors, hatchback, headlights, etc."

Seriously, you knew what this car was potentially going to be (a GR Yaris drivetrain in a Corolla Hatch), but feel the need to complain that it actually may come to fruition for once? This why we don't get the good stuff, and why the stuff we get is half assed crap (A90 Supra).

People are sus about this car period, because Toyota USA f'd over our market as was mentioned above. That teased the GR Yaris to us stating Murica do you want it? Got damn, everyone else got it. I mean Mexico got the damn thing, Europe, Australia. But we don't, because we have too many crackers in Murica. Everything needs to be a family truckster unless it's expensive. Take a look at the CUV market for reference. So Toyota was the hot girl hitting on you, dropping her jeans and showing her panties, etc. Flirting with you then told you to go f yourself. They did that, the US enthusiasts did not. Hell the US or let's include our Canadian friends in this too, signed a petition that went to Toyota and I forget how many signatures it had. I signed the f'er. I think it was in excess of 15k people or more. My $ was ready to, to sign a check for the entire thing I wanted it so bad. I've been waiting my whole life for a homologation WRC for the street. Here it is, it's teased to me, then it's F U we aren't bringing it for you because your country is tarded. So now we are potentially getting the older lady in mom jeans and you want us to do backflips?

So people are sus because they already got screwed over once. They will remain skeptical. The FWD Corolla is 3060 pounds for one. You think they are going to throw the Yaris all wheel drivetrain in there, with the front and rear LSD's, keep at or under 3000 pounds, and keep the price reasonable? Hey I hope so and I will be a potential buyer but at the end of the day it is not the homologation WRC that the Yaris GR4 is. It's looking like a watered down version. The GR4 was made with this engine, drivetrain, chassis, etc, to be a solid package. Buyers have every right to be extremely skeptical, it's their money, and Toyota already did a bait and switch on us. Again I'm a potential buyer but there are going to have to deliver on every single metric based on their previously mentioned multiple times bs. No diffs, no sale. I'm not going to jerk it because it has AWD, it needs the circuit pack. It better have the attention to the chassis that the Yaris did. It better have use of aluminum to keep the weight down. If I want to steak I'm buying a steak. A McDeez hamburger is not the same thing. It's my money. It's tens of thousands of dollars. I want the special car and I was ready to buy it. You family truckster it, then my interest wanes and it has to compete with the Golf R, and the STi. Those vehicles will have 4 cylinder turbos and the potential to make much more power.

I am also quite tired of everything like this, that is a performance vehicle, having to be 4/5 doors. It's old. I'm not buying the car to sit in traffic with it wasting it using it as a commuter. It will never see a drive thru, never be parked at a mall. It will only be used in a sporting fashion driven in anger. It will never have kid seats put in it nor used to haul IKEA furniture. I'll buy a 4/5 door car but it's going to have to be really special. If not, why should I give away my hard earned forty thousand dollars? I don't buy cars in terms of "payments". And I don't have to buy anything, especially this. Make something special, memorable, worth buying and keeping a long time, or go back to making your ergonomically challenged, soulless commuters that are completely uninspiring. I'm still interested and keeping an eye on the car. 3000 lbs, 300 HP, front and rear diffs, and it's priced competitively, they may get a purchase. May is key. The GR4 was a definite buy and I was ready to write a check, something I have never done for any car. A chance is all I can give them seeing as they baited and switched us. A chance is all they deserve. It doesn't deliver on every metric...if it comes with no LSD's, they can keep it. Let it be a lesson to the mf'ers. It's my money they are after. That $ is hard earned and I'm not parting with it easily. I'm getting so tired of weak engines (my Focus RS), old engines (STi) that if I find a B7 RS4 for a song, for a dedicated resto project including rebuilding the motor I'm game. I look at the new Golf R with all this haptic crap, no physical controls and a bunch of screens and the more I look at that the more I don't want it. If I wanted a Tesla I'd buy one.

Hope that answers your questions. RAD is on so I gotta go and root on Cru to take down Hell Track!

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Old 05-09-2021, 11:06 PM   #96
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Is it just me, but before this news, people were like "Oh the Corolla is going to be crap if it doesn't have the AWD, engine, transmission, and Diffs of the GR Yaris". Now it looks like it does and the comments are like "I don't want a car with a 3-cylinder, 4/5 doors, hatchback, headlights, etc."

Seriously, you knew what this car was potentially going to be (a GR Yaris drivetrain in a Corolla Hatch), but feel the need to complain that it actually may come to fruition for once? This why we don't get the good stuff, and why the stuff we get is half assed crap (A90 Supra).
Isnt this how people and nasioc are about almost every car? Like, for as long as nasioc has existed? Nobody has 'liked' the new or upcoming wrx or any subaru model on the forums, even if they later bought one. Its been hatersville for as long as I can remember. Nobodys ever open minded or happy with anything.

No wonder all the moderators went Miata...
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Old 05-10-2021, 01:07 AM   #97
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GR Yaris dominated the 2020 Tokyo Auto Salon, stirring up an outcry in North America over its absence. And it's easy to see why. A radical hot hatch, GR Yaris is equipped with an all-new 268-horsepower, 90 turbocharged 3-cylinder engine; a rally-derived GR-FOUR All-Wheel Drive system; and a track-proven suspension. It's the same engineering that helped to make TOYOTA GAZOO Racing a dominant force in the World Rally Championship. While GR Yaris isn't coming to the U.S., perhaps it's time the U.S. got a Toyota hot hatch to call its own. One that continues to push the boundaries of performance. And one that can only come from TOYOTA GAZOO Racing. Are you with us?
NASIOC accounts for 100% of the outcry.
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Old 05-10-2021, 03:19 AM   #98
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NASIOC accounts for 100% of the outcry.


If you buy a carbonated beverage, whether it be soda or beer, hey, you on Nasioc should be happy with a watered down beverage with no carbonation. Just deal with it and pay your moneys!
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Old 05-10-2021, 08:52 AM   #99
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Isnt this how people and nasioc are about almost every car? Like, for as long as nasioc has existed? Nobody has 'liked' the new or upcoming wrx or any subaru model on the forums, even if they later bought one. Its been hatersville for as long as I can remember. Nobodys ever open minded or happy with anything.

No wonder all the moderators went Miata...
I think Miata's being very good drivers cars with FR layout, a massive following, aftermarket and support are why they went Miata.
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Old 05-10-2021, 10:17 AM   #100
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That was also a joke dude. A running joke from ot from years ago....
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