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Old 08-19-2009, 03:29 PM   #26
St3fan
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Originally Posted by zombiefeedingtime View Post
Hey St3f, how old a guy are you?

I had some pretty rough depression/anxiety in my early/mid 20's. It's seemed to get much better in my late 20's.

I do take fish oil daily, and it honestly seems to help. I don't care if its placebo or not, if it works, it works. My lows and anxiety aren't as bad as they used to be. I can cope fine for the most part now.
I'm 31.

It used to be much worse, now it just occasionally stalks me!

I take B vitamins, keep hydrated, exercise and, unsuccessfully, try and avoid hangovers and coffee!
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Old 08-19-2009, 03:32 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by St3fan View Post
I'm 31.

It used to be much worse, now it just occasionally stalks me!

I take B vitamins, keep hydrated, exercise and, unsuccessfully, try and avoid hangovers and coffee!
I'm 31 as well. I still get it occasionally, but typically only when there's a big change coming around.

Some folks just don't respond well to medication. The anti-anxiety meds to help, but they tend to put me to sleep, which I guess is a good thing. I just take half a pill when I need em, which thankfully is pretty rare these days.

I heard a few years back that some people just develop coping mechanisms as they get older. They just get used to it and it bothers them less and less over time. Hang in there.
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Old 08-19-2009, 03:39 PM   #28
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Having just gone on Ativan last week, I'm feeling a LOT better. It really takes the edge off.

For those who say "just don't worry so much" you can huff a wall of dongs. If it were only that easy. I've made it 31 years by just taking it easy and telling myself to relax and finding ways to calm down... but recent events just overloaded my system.

I've literally become sick with worry. It sucks. It is not by choice, and you can't just "turn it off" by choice either. Being sick, it then becomes very difficult to get exercise or eat properly, and it messes with your sleep, so the whole thing becomes a self-perpetuating cycle.

Enter the Ativan.

Able to sleep better (was waking up with cold sweats, not sure why). Able to eat better. Everything starts to feel better, physically. Interacting with my friends and family better. The whole situation improves, hopefully to the point where I can go off this in a month and be back on an even keel.
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Old 08-19-2009, 03:41 PM   #29
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Benzos are very effective for when you feel like this, but valium and xanax are higher up on the list of potential addiction drugs. Really use only as needed for times such as now. Good luck.
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Old 08-19-2009, 03:49 PM   #30
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Able to sleep better (was waking up with cold sweats, not sure why). Able to eat better. Everything starts to feel better, physically. Interacting with my friends and family better. The whole situation improves, hopefully to the point where I can go off this in a month and be back on an even keel.
Good luck. Post an update when you do.
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Benzos are very effective for when you feel like this, but valium and xanax are higher up on the list of potential addiction drugs. Really use only as needed for times such as now. Good luck.
Valium and Xanax are both benzodiazepines, aren't they?

And yeah, a hot shower and more water seems to have done the trick.

I posted this thread as a lot of people have alluded to having anxiety issues at various times. It would be good to share tricks/tips for dealing, you know? *grouphug*
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Old 08-19-2009, 03:54 PM   #31
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I've been drinking water like it was going out of style.

I pee a lot now. Not much else different. I just didn't want to upset my stomach further with a lot of soda and such.
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Old 08-19-2009, 03:59 PM   #32
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SSRI > benzos for long-term management of GAD
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Old 08-19-2009, 04:02 PM   #33
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The best thing I ever discovered was honesty.

Like, when people ask how I'm feeling - usually because they've picked up on something being wrong - I used to tell them I feel fine.

Now I just tell them I feel anxious and terrible, if that's the case. It helps a lot, as then, people aren't expecting you to be normal.
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Old 08-19-2009, 04:03 PM   #34
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Not the answer for me I'm afraid. I'd rather roll with it than pick up a pill habit.
Yep, my counterpart is off for the next two weeks and I am having to pick up his workstream in addition to my own and I'm getting married in two months and I'm moving across the country in 3 months and I want to go climbing after work but I don't think I'll have time.

I am kinda sorta wigging out. But no pills for me, please.
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Old 08-19-2009, 04:03 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by rogue View Post

For those who say "just don't worry so much" you can huff a wall of dongs.
To be honest, almost dying pretty much cured me all of anxiety

Every new day is a 'blessing' for me

C/N: try to have a near-death experience.
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Old 08-19-2009, 04:19 PM   #36
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any chance you've increased your weed intake lately?
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Old 08-19-2009, 04:28 PM   #37
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If we party all night long, my girlfriend has serious anxiety the next day. She'll call multiple times to ask if we are "ok" or "Are you mad at me?" Stuff like that. She'll be in a panic most of the day. A bloody mary or two usually helps.
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Old 08-19-2009, 04:29 PM   #38
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I had my first attack a few weeks ago. It came out of nowhere for seemingly no reason. I'm still trying to make sense of it.

Some people made some really great points and shared their stories in the thread I started, it might be worth a read St3fan.

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=1816507
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Old 08-19-2009, 06:12 PM   #39
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Yep, my counterpart is off for the next two weeks and I am having to pick up his workstream in addition to my own and I'm getting married in two months and I'm moving across the country in 3 months and I want to go climbing after work but I don't think I'll have time.

I am kinda sorta wigging out. But no pills for me, please.
Fight the temptation!
Quote:
Originally Posted by chris619 View Post
To be honest, almost dying pretty much cured me all of anxiety

Every new day is a 'blessing' for me

C/N: try to have a near-death experience.
I had one of those. Almost a year in the hospital. Too young to really give a fig at the time, now the excitement of the fallout randomly killing me is something I get to deal with.
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any chance you've increased your weed intake lately?
I never smoke weed, not being a hippie or a student or whatever...
Quote:
Originally Posted by testify View Post
I had my first attack a few weeks ago. It came out of nowhere for seemingly no reason. I'm still trying to make sense of it.

Some people made some really great points and shared their stories in the thread I started, it might be worth a read St3fan.

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/show....php?t=1816507
Totally missed that. How are you feeling?

Remember, don't give yourself anxiety by worrying about having anxiety. That is one vicious circle that can **** off!
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Old 08-19-2009, 06:22 PM   #40
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increase rest, hobby, activities to keep things off your mind for a bit??
perhaps a short weekend vacation somewhere - friends/family, etc
or try Paxil cr, have you tried any light therapy sessions?

at least you are on the OT. best place to get advice.

anxiety blows.
good luck my friend
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Old 08-19-2009, 06:28 PM   #41
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One species, Rhodiola rosea (also known as "golden root"), is of particular interest. This species is widely distributed at high altitudes in Arctic and mountain regions throughout Europe and Asia, and has been a popular plant in traditional medicine in various areas of both Eastern Europe and Asia [1]. In Chinese medicine, it is used to enhance resistance against fatigue [2]. This species has been studied intensively in Russia and Scandinavia for over 35 years. The clearest benefit is adaptogenic and anti-stress activities, with memory support [1-5].

A number of pharmacologically active components have been identified in Rhodiola species, including organic acids, flavanoids, tannins, and phenolic glycosides [1]. Phenylpropanoid tyrosol (p. tyrosol), its glucoside salidroside (also known as rhodioloside or rhodosin), and phenylpropenoids rosin, rosarin, and rosavin all play important antioxidant and neurostimulant roles in the activity of Rhodiola rosea [2], with rhodioniside, rhodiolin, and rosiridin also implicated in R. rosea's adaptogenic activity [1]. Numerous other antioxidant compounds have been identified in Rhodiola species, including gallic acid, (-)-epigallocatechin 3-O-gallate, kaempferol, kaempferol 7-O-alpha-L-rhamnopyranoside, herbacetin 7-O-alpha-L-rhamnopyranoside, and rhodiolinin [6].

The mechanisms of action of Rhodiola rosea are many. These include antioxidant activity, propyl endopeptidase inhibition [2, 5], facilitation of monoaminergic activity, and opioid receptor activation. The enzyme propyl endopeptidase metabolizes various proline-containing neuropeptides including vasopressin, substance P, thyrotropin-releasing hormone, and alpha-melanocyte-stimulating hormone, all of which may play roles in learning and memory processes [5, 7]. Indeed, other propyl endopeptidase inhibitors improve spatial memory in animal models [7-8]. Rhodiola rosea may also inhibit monoamine oxidase (MAO) and catechol-O-methyltransferase (COMT) and facilitate the transport of neurotransmittors in the brain [1]. Another mechanism of action is the release of endorphins. Russian research indicates that Rhodiola rosea induces opioid peptide biosynthesis by activating opioid receptors in both the central and peripheral nervous system [1].

Rhodiola is among the herbs classified as adaptogens. The term "adaptogen" originated in Russia in 1947, and is defined as a substance that allows an organism to counteract adverse physical, chemical, or biological stressors by generating non-specific resistance. In 1969, specific criteria were created which need to be fulfilled before a substance qualifies as an adaptogen. Because Rhodiola rosea prevents a variety of deleterious effects caused by physical and intellectual stress and illness, it is classified as an adaptogen [1]. Rhodiola is also unique among adaptogens, in that it may be more effective than others in periods of acute stress, while most are primarily effective only in periods of chronic stress.

Because of its adaptogenic properties and its ability to increase the efficiency of mitochondrial respiration in skeletal muscle [3], Rhodiola is particularly useful for athletes, who regularly engage in taxing, high-intensity exercise, as it may both improve recovery and increase work output. As far as clinical trials in humans, the research in this area is sparse but very promising. A study with 1.5 grams per day of a Rhodiola crenulata root (which has a similar profile of active constituents to Rhodiola rosea) extract for 75 days found that it increased run time to exhaustion and maximum oxygen consumption in athletes [9]. Studies on the effect Rhodiola has on the work output of animals have also been done. Administration of Rhodiola for 10 days significantly increased the time that rats could spend running on a treadbane, with an even more significant increase after 20 days [10], and Rhodiola also increased the swimming times of rats in a "swim to the limit" test by 135-159% [1, 10].

In addition to increasing physical work capacity, Rhodiola rosea increases mental work capacity and induces a resistance to mental fatigue. In fact, it may directly support memory even in non-stressful conditions. Three double-blind placebo-controlled trials have recently been conducted in humans in this regard. The largest tested the effect of two doses of a standardized Rhodiola rosea extract in 160 19-21 year old cadets on mental capacity during a period of fatigue and stress. It found that both doses reduced the level of fatigue as measured by the antifatigue index (AFI) by over 10% [11]. Another study assessed the effect the same extract had on 56 young physicians on measures of mental fatigue, including tests of associative thinking, short-term memory, calculation and ability to concentrate, and speed of audio-visual perception during two weeks of night duty. There was a statistically significant improvement on all five tests used in the treatment group [12]. The last study looked at the effects a Rhodiola rosea extract had on physical and intellectual working capacity and measures of well being during a 20 day exam period in 40 students. The students that received Rhodiola had significant improvements. The treatment group also had 8.5% higher scores on the final exam [1, 13].

There have also been animal studies on the effect Rhodiola has on mental performance. In one of them, .1 mL of a Rhodiola rosea extract improved learning and memory within 24 hours and also improved long-term memory after 10 days in rats. However, two other doses of 20% as much and 10 times as much were ineffective, suggesting that there is a window of therapeutic activity [14]. Substantial neuroprotection has also been observed, with Rhodiola rosea having numerous benefits on metabolic processes in the brain [15].

Rhodiola also has adaptogenic activity in high altitude environments. Studies in humans living in high altitudes have found that Rhodiola improves sleep architecture and quality, along with other benefits [3, 16].
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Cognitive Performance and Stress

Tyrosine is particularly useful at combating the decrements in cognitive performance associated with stress and fatigue. Various stressors result in increased catecholamine synthesis and release and consequently increased precursor demand, and many stress-related changes in behavior and cognition are associated with catecholamine depletion [18]. Norepinephrine depletion is associated with behavioral depression and decreased exploration and motor behavior in animals and lowered attention span in humans, and dopamine is important for learning and memory processes [19]. Since stress results in increased catecholamine synthesis and depletion, it is likely that the impact of tyrosine supplementation will become more pronounced in this state.

In a number of experimental paradigms, tyrosine reduces or prevents impairments in cognition and other negative effects caused by stressors. One study found tyrosine restored maze performance to normal in mice fed a 40% restricted diet [15]. In other rodent studies, tyrosine has protected from behavioral and neurochemical changes associated with hypoxia, restraint stress, and tail-shock. Some of the effects prevented were an increase in corticosterone and NE depletion [17]. Treatment of sheep subjected to stress with large amounts of tyrosine reduced many of the physiological changes, including the increase in cortisol [20]. Tyrosine has also been reported to increase the survival rate in rats stressed by sepsis and acute hemmorhagic shock [7].

In humans subjected to stressful conditions, tyrosine not only improves working memory and attention but may also improve mood and well-being [14, 18]. Tyrosine has been reported to alleviate some of the negative consequences of cold, high altitudes, fatigue, military training, and sleep deprivation [21-22]. It has also been postulated to decrease stress under conditions of aging, anorexia, and obesity [21].

One study in healthy young men compared the effects of 150 mg/kg tyrosine, caffeine, phentermine, and D-amphetamine on cognitive performance in sleep deprived subjects. Tyrosine improved performance on several tests, but was not as effective as D-amphetamine [22]. Another study found that tyrosine did not affect sleep related measures such as sleep quantity and quality after sleep deprivation, while the other psychostimulants did [23]. In subjects exposed to cold and hypoxia, tyrosine reduced the incidence of headache, tension, fatigue, and psychomotor impairments. In another study in healthy subjects subjected to 90 dB noise, tyrosine improved mental performance and reduced blood pressure relative to placebo [19].

Because most of the research has focused on highly stressful conditions that are not commonly encountered in real life, a study was conducted to see if tyrosine was still effective under conditions of relatively mild stress. This was measured by the ability to perform multiple simple tasks simultaneously. When subjects were given simple tasks, such as arithmetic, auditory monitoring, visual monitoring, and a memory task, tyrosine did not improve performance. When asked to perform multiple simple tasks at the same time, performance on the memory task was significantly better in subjects receiving tyrosine. This study demonstrated that tyrosine can improve cognitive performance even in the absence of significant stress-related biological changes [18].
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Effects on Mood & Cognition

Theanine may have has shown to support mood. In human studies, oral administration of theanine has been reported to dose-dependently increase the production of alpha waves in the occipital and parietal regions of the brain [6-8]. According to one article, this signifies a state of being awake, alert, and relaxed at the same time. This effect occurs within 30-40 minutes of oral administration of 50-200 mg. It should be noted that the study population in this research consisted only of females 18-22 years of age, and this effect has not yet been confirmed in other human populations [8].

The behavioral effects of theanine on rodents have also been the subject of study. Theanine does not change activity level or exploration behavior in normal animals. However, it does improve performance on a number of tests of memory and learning, including the active avoidance test, the passive avoidance test, and the Morris water maze [9]. Using electroencephalography, it has also been determined that theanine antagonizes the effect of caffeine. If about eight times as much theanine than caffeine is given (on a per milligram basis), the effect of caffeine is completely blunted [2, 10]. It has been suggested that theanine is responsible for the relaxing effect of tea despite the caffeine content.

Animal studies have also explored the possible mechanism by which theanine leads to these effects. Theanine reliably causes a significant increase in CNS dopamine (DA) levels, especially in the striatum, hypothalamus, and hippocampus [2, 9, 11-12]. The effect theanine has on levels of other neurotransmitters is less well-established. It has been reported to both increase and decrease central serotonin levels [11-12]. One study indicated that it may decrease central norepinephrine [3]. Finally, a study in the early 70's reported that theanine may have an effect on the formation of gamma-aminobutyric acid (GABA) [13]. The direct mechanism for these changes is not clear, although it may be related to an effect at N-methyl-D-aspartate (NMDA) receptors [14].

Neuroprotection

Theanine has neuroprotective properties in experimental models. In animals, theanine has also been reported to increase the synthesis rate of nerve growth factor (NGF) [6].

The neuroprotective properties are thought to be primarily due to the fact that it is structurally similar to glutamate. Glutamate is an excitatory neurotransmitter, and in some instances it can cause excitotoxicity [14]. It has been traditionally thought that theanine prevents toxicity by acting as a competitive antagonist to glutamate at ionotropic glutamate receptors, of which there are three types, NMDA, alpha-amino-3-hydroxy-5-methylisoxazol-4-propionic acid (AMPA), and kainate (KA) [15]. In rat cortical neurons, theanine acted at all three subtypes, but had less binding affinity than glutamate. Also, the binding affinity to NMDA receptors was an order of magnitude lower than to AMPA and KA receptors [14]. It is possible that actions at all of the subtypes could play important roles in the activity of theanine.

Because the effective concentration in antagonizing ionotropic glutamate receptors is so low compared to glutamate, a more recent study hypothesized that the neuroprotective effect was related to an effect at metabotropic glutamate receptors instead [11]. This study found that inhibition of glutamate-induced neuronal death by theanine could be inhibited by an antagonist of group I metabotropic glutamate receptors. This indicates that this may be the mechanism for the neuroprotective effect of theanine. Given the current state of research, it is too early to draw any solid conclusions, as the effect of theanine could ultimately prove to be due to an action at any combination of these receptors. An effect on glutamate transporters may also be involved [14].

A final mechanism of neuroprotection is the antioxidant effect of theanine. One study suggested that one of the protective mechanisms was inhibition of lipid peroxidation. Vitamin E has also been found to inhibit ischemia induced by MCA occlusion [15].
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I am not a doctor. Do not mix this **** with your meds. They are natural and harmless when taken by normal, healthy individuals, but may pose issues if you really have serious problems. I only posted this to give those interested a possible alternative to other drugs/meds, you are responsible for doing your own research, and the outcome thereof.

That being said, L-theanine is VERY benign isht extracted from green tea, very good for you. Rhodiola and tyrosine are also very well studied and documented.
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Old 08-19-2009, 06:30 PM   #42
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Totally missed that. How are you feeling?

Remember, don't give yourself anxiety by worrying about having anxiety. That is one vicious circle that can **** off!

In my situation, i think it was just a fluke. I think I hyperventilated for another reason other than anxiety. It was a really hot day, my truck doesn't have AC, I wasn't feeling well, and I think I just started breathing to heavy and that casued the attack. I just try to be more conscious of how I'm breathing now. And i have a bottle of pills just in case, but I don't anticipate having to use them any time soon.
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Old 08-19-2009, 06:35 PM   #43
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Yeah, I go for months on end feeling totally fine. The occasional nastiness creeps in for a week then goes away. I felt like I was going to implode this morning, I have to say - brightened up a bit now, however.
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Old 08-19-2009, 06:38 PM   #44
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I get them a lot while driving.

My mind feels like it's about to snap and I will lose all sense of reality. It's pretty scary sometimes.

Plus the heart palps are just sweet
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Old 08-19-2009, 06:41 PM   #45
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I have been having odd bouts of anxiety quite frequently myself.

I despise my job so much that I have actually been throwing up in the mornings. I think it is due to the uncertainty in my future regarding school & work.
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Old 08-19-2009, 06:44 PM   #46
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Yeah, I go for months on end feeling totally fine. The occasional nastiness creeps in for a week then goes away. I felt like I was going to implode this morning, I have to say - brightened up a bit now, however.

Get a prescription for the .25mg xanax. In that small dosage, the pills will not give you any euphoria so I can't really see them as habit forming. But they really do just mellow you out enough to take the edge off. I never really believed in chemical cures, but it may be worth a shot if its affecting your life so much.
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Old 08-19-2009, 06:51 PM   #47
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I took Lexapro for a while. Really gives you some perspective on what it is like when you turn off the anxiety, because that is really what it did. A little too much though overall. Eventually the psychiatrist I was going to made me feel like a junkie by demanding I do more therapy sessions with him at $400 an hour (even though I was seeing a social worker for talk therapy and only went to the other guy for the prescriptions) and so I stopped taking it. I was only on about 10mg, but apparently they say that is about the equivalent of 30mg of Celexa.

Now, I just try to deal as best I can without the drugs. Exercise helps to some extent. I also have some books that I go to for cognitive therapy reminders. I wouldn't have a problem going for more drugs if I really needed them, but so far I'm okay.

Quote:
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Having just gone on Ativan last week, I'm feeling a LOT better. It really takes the edge off.

For those who say "just don't worry so much" you can huff a wall of dongs. If it were only that easy. I've made it 31 years by just taking it easy and telling myself to relax and finding ways to calm down... but recent events just overloaded my system.

I've literally become sick with worry. It sucks. It is not by choice, and you can't just "turn it off" by choice either. Being sick, it then becomes very difficult to get exercise or eat properly, and it messes with your sleep, so the whole thing becomes a self-perpetuating cycle.

Enter the Ativan.

Able to sleep better (was waking up with cold sweats, not sure why). Able to eat better. Everything starts to feel better, physically. Interacting with my friends and family better. The whole situation improves, hopefully to the point where I can go off this in a month and be back on an even keel.
Yeah, this is why a lot of our family are functioning alcoholics.
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Old 08-19-2009, 06:52 PM   #48
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You know what makes me feel better when that happens to me? Imagining your wife sliding down a maple syrup-coated Slip-n-Slide into a pool of angry naked midgets hooped up on Viagra and Adderal.

God, it just makes you smiles, doesn't it?

Of course, if you could get your hands on a Slip-n-Slide and some prescription drugs...
I just might try this...
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Old 08-19-2009, 06:53 PM   #49
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I get them a lot while driving.

My mind feels like it's about to snap and I will lose all sense of reality. It's pretty scary sometimes.

Plus the heart palps are just sweet
It's probably from you breathing differently or slower. It used to happen to me, same with eating. Try focusing on breathing. I know this sounds odd.
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Originally Posted by Drink View Post
I have been having odd bouts of anxiety quite frequently myself.

I despise my job so much that I have actually been throwing up in the mornings. I think it is due to the uncertainty in my future regarding school & work.
Urgh, gross. Good luck!
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Originally Posted by testify View Post
Get a prescription for the .25mg xanax. In that small dosage, the pills will not give you any euphoria so I can't really see them as habit forming. But they really do just mellow you out enough to take the edge off. I never really believed in chemical cures, but it may be worth a shot if its affecting your life so much.
You know, it's better now than ever.

Xanax removed my sexdrive almost completely when I tried it once. I'd rather be anxious and horny...
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Old 08-19-2009, 07:00 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by St3fan View Post
Xanax removed my sexdrive almost completely when I tried it once. I'd rather be anxious and horny...
You probably ate one of those big Xanax Bars that are 8 times the dosage of the .25mg pill. Alcohol definately increases the effects as well. And maybe it was the smelly fat chick you were trying to get with. It could be any number of things that affected your libido. Don't just assume it was the meds.
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